Talk:Steve Hilton

Untitled

Strong keep. Hilton is to Cameron as Campbell was to Blair. He is the power behind the throne (according to Peter Hitchens, "Dolly" Draper). We need to track down reliable information about this person and his activities. pmcray 16:34, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

4 X 2 ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.41.170.194 (talk) 17:16, 2 March 2012 (UTC)

Don’t agree the page urgently needs comment on Hilton’s reaction to Ann Coulter comments on his show and his enthusiastic non critical support for trump. Hilton is not accurately described on the page Lawrenson77 (talk) 20:00, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Future speculation

It is unclear to me that the section we have about him having dinner with Boris Johnson is in any way useful, particularly now that Hilton is leaving Number 10 to move to California with his wife. The newspaper story is speculation about him taking some kind of position in the Mayor's office (which he obviously isn't going to do now) and speculating further about him running for Mayor himself many years from now. Given the full context of his career, this seems overblown unless there are substantial sources - one newspaper speculation strikes me as not enough.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 16:00, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

Agreed - speculation - and undue - its not happening and was never likely to either. - removed - Youreallycan 10:23, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Sources gave Stanford post as a reason - seems better balanced now. The "arrest" bit was actually contrary to the sources, and is not correct. Collect (talk) 12:24, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Yes, your correct - thank you - Youreallycan 13:05, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

Fox News

He has become an important weekend host on the Fox News Channel. This is missing in the article. Lou Sander (talk) 02:53, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

Career In British Politics

This article doesn't completely reflect his career in British Politics. He was around for a long time. Also it would be more useful to be clear that he was chief advisor to Cameron from 2010 to 2012 per the New Stateseman article. As the article just presently states how long Cameron was Prime Minister. I might try and add this myself but I wanted to start a talk section about fleshing out his career from a Saatchi ad man to present. Barry Mason (talk) 10:16, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Sources do not support section titled “2020 election fraud claim”

WP:V Verifiability, and WP:BLPRS / BLPSOURCES - Contentious statements based on inaccurate sources / unsourced

For transparency I disclose a connection to the article subject when pointing out the below.

I nominate the section titled “2020 election fraud claims” for correction or removal as it contains a contentious claim that is unsourced and inaccurate. Although the section purports to cite two articles in the Independent Newspaper, the relevant sections of those articles are actually worded substantially differently to the Wikipedia entry, and do not support it.

In particular the headline of the section and the first sentence are not supported by what is written in the articles.

The Independent articles report more closely the actual words the biography subject used in his broadcasts on the topic, however this section does not. This can be independently verified from the original clips of the broadcast in question: YouTube.com/watch?v=o9829am7inE

The biography subject has also made it clear that contrary to the claims in this section, he did not and does not endorse any claim the 2020 election was “stolen” , and that this has been tested in court and rejected. Dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-12029731/Kamala-Harris-Ron-DeSantis-blames-senile-mans-finger-Americas—nuclear-button.html

” of course, the 2020 presidential election was not stolen. As I argued at the time there were certainly serious issues with the election for example the tech companies censoring evidence of the Biden family’s shady overseas business dealings. And in key battleground states democrats introduced last minute changes to voting procedures that were arguably not in line with constitutional rules and designed for partisan advantage. But the time to challenge all that was before the election not afterwards. Claims of large scale fraud were tested in the courts and rejected, which is why I for one never gave them the time of day”

I suggest that the relevant rules are wp:blprs/blpsources “contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced should be removed immediately and without discussion” and wp:v “all content must be verifiable” & “the cited source must clearly support the material as presented in the article”. Editrequest (talk) 14:43, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

2020 election request

Hello editors. My name is SK and I am here as part of my work with Steve Hilton. Because of this conflict of interest, I am seeking updates here in place of direct editing.

I ask if editors can consider correcting information currently in the False 2020 election fraud claims section. As written, the section says "Hilton promoted Trump's false claims of large-scale fraud on his Fox News show", yet that's not supported by the cited sources. Instead, in reference No. 11, The Independent writes: "In the immediate aftermath of the 2020 election, he backed calls for an investigation into claims of election fraud". Reference No. 46 quotes heavily from Hilton's broadcast. While the source says Hilton "demands a 'fair investigation' into unsubstantiated claims of voter fraud", it does not say Hilton promoted Trump's claims of large-scale fraud, as this Wikipedia article declares.

There is nuance here, but given Wikipedia's rules on Biographies of living persons, this article should more closely resemble the source material. The source material never says Hilton amplified Trump's claims. Instead, he said that "any evidence of fraud or irregularity should be brought forward and the court should adjudicate." Hilton also said "But when it’s this close. This important with this many late changes to the rules, of course, we should investigate them thoroughly. Not just for the sake of the win but for the sake of faith in our system."

It would be fine for these points to be specifically mentioned on Wikipedia, as Hilton made them and they have been reported on by The Independent. But they should be written in a way that reflects what is in the reliable source, per Verifiability.

I suggest the following:

• Replace the False 2020 election fraud claims heading with 2020 election
  • Reason: This is a more neutral heading, per Neutral point of view.
• Replace "After Trump was defeated by Joe Biden in the 2020 presidential election, Hilton promoted Trump's false claims of large-scale fraud on his Fox News show. Trump subsequently tweeted a string of Hilton clips." with the following:
  • On his Fox News broadcast, Hilton supported calls for investigations into claims of election fraud following the 2020 presidential election, clips of which were tweeted by Trump.
    • Reason: This content meets Wikipedia's Verifiability and Neutral point of view standards.

References

Please let me know if you have any questions I can answer. I'll do the best that I can! SKflo (talk) 17:20, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

Reply 26-SEP-2023

  Discussion required  

1. Controversial issues ought not to be resolved through the COI edit request feature, a feature which is primarily meant for COI editors to propose nominally controversial edits to be reviewed by a neutral third party editor. Edit requests involving overtly controversial proposals such as the ones proposed here are not recommended for use with the {{Edit COI}} template.
2. The process of content dispute resolution needed here should begin with a discussion of the issues with local editors here on this talk page. To that end, the COI editor is invited to continue the discussion below.
3. If consensus is achieved, and that consensus is that the information ought to be removed and/or clarified in the article, the COI editor may then invoke the {{Edit COI}} template to have a neutral editor make those changes. If no consensus is found here on the talk page alone, the COI editor may then follow up by using any of the subsequent dispute resolution strategies listed under WP:CONTENTDISPUTE.

Regards,  Spintendo  19:15, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

Notes

References

Thank you, Spintendo. I will invite others to the conversation. SKflo (talk) 16:07, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

I would support this re-write - On his Fox News broadcast, Hilton demanded an investigation into false claims of election fraud following the 2020 presidential election, clips of which were tweeted by Trump. Your version ignores the fact that the election claims were false. And I don't know why you tagged those refs as "paid subscription", when they are not. Isaidnoway (talk) 11:49, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

@Isaidnoway: Thank you for your feedback, and I appreciate your suggestion. I do think some of the nuance is missed, though. As you proposed, the wording could be misread as saying Hilton supported investigations into claims he knew were false, and that's not supported by the source material. While it's obviously too lengthy to include in the Wikipedia article, the source material states:

In an impassioned appeal for an investigation into alleged voter fraud, Hilton asked: "How could any reasonable person not agree that every legal vote should be counted? No illegal vote should be counted. Any evidence of fraud or irregularity should be brought forward and the court should adjudicate,” adding that this is what "the president said. That’s what Mitt Romney said. It’s even what Biden said."

Hilton went on to argue that "every election has some level of fraud, irregularity, error," but it usually "doesn't affect the outcome".

"But when it's this close. This important with this many late changes to the rules, of course, we should investigate them thoroughly. Not just for the sake of the win but for the sake of faith in our system."

Also, I believe the word "demands" is too strong or opinionated here. Although I do recognize the source material uses "demands", it also uses other language that reads more encyclopedia-appropriate to me.

With these points in mind, I wonder if you'd be willing to consider compromise language:

On his Fox News broadcast, Hilton appealed for "a fair investigation" into claims of election fraud following the 2020 presidential election, which were found to be unsubstantiated.

References

As for the URL access parameter of the citation: those are pre-existing citations in the live article. I just copy/pasted the formatting here. But since you pointed it out, I updated the citation formatting to remove the subscription. Thanks. SKflo (talk) 17:41, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

No, I wouldn't consider anything that doesn't say false claims of election fraud. Isaidnoway (talk) 19:29, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Isaidnoway: That's fair. I appreciate you hearing me out. Your wording is better than what is on the page now. When you have time, please do go ahead and make your suggested update:

• On his Fox News broadcast, Hilton demanded an investigation into false claims of election fraud following the 2020 presidential election, clips of which were tweeted by Trump.

References

Please note that I updated the citations based on your comment about the URL access parameter. Thanks. SKflo (talk) 17:55, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

Think tank and ballot measure request

Hi editors, I had another request, this time for an addition to the article related to a ballot measure Hilton has proposed. I propose adding the following sentence to the Career section:

• In 2023, Hilton founded Golden Together, a bipartisan think tank, with Lanhee Chen and Gloria Romero. The same year, he proposed a ballot initiative designed to reduce the housing shortage in California. The measure would prohibit private lawsuits related to the California Environmental Quality Act and cap impact fees paid by homebuilders and developers.

References

Please let me know what you think. SKflo (talk) 15:59, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

I would suggest the following:

In 2023, Hilton founded Golden Together, a bipartisan think tank, with Lanhee Chen and Gloria Romero. The same year, he proposed a ballot initiative for 2024 designed to reduce the housing shortage in California, a measure which the San Francisco Chronicle called a "developer's giveaway" because it would place a "tight cap on fees" as well as restrict "who can file California Environmental Quality Act lawsuits aimed at their [developers] projects."

Please advise. Regards,  Spintendo  17:49, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

@Spintendo: I appreciate your quick response. I have some concerns about the language you've proposed, which seems less than NPOV to me. I think the more neutral way to present it to readers is to note what the ballot initiative proposes before opinions about it. I also think that it's important to include all of the opinions within the Chronicle article, not just the negative ones. I'd even question the appropriateness of including them at all, because they aren't actual opinions of real people, but predicted reactions. However, if you think that those predictions should be in an article about a living person, I'd suggest something more like the following:

• In 2023, Hilton founded Golden Together, a bipartisan think tank, with Lanhee Chen and Gloria Romero. The same year, he proposed a ballot initiative designed to reduce the housing shortage in California. The measure would prohibit private lawsuits related to the California Environmental Quality Act and cap impact fees paid by homebuilders and developers. The San Francisco Chronicle's Joe Garofoli called the ballot initiative a "developer giveaway", noting that it would give developers two of their major desires, but also that it may help stabilize construction workforces and drew more attention to housing issues in California.

References

What do you think? SKflo (talk) 21:37, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

 Done Sources match info. Rephrasing seems uncontroversial. STEMinfo (talk) 21:34, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

Reframing election request

Hi editors, I thought I would revisit the elections request I had earlier and condense conversations into a new post so it's easier for new editors to discuss the topic.

In short, I proposed a change to the False 2020 election fraud claims section. The changes were twofold:

• Rename the heading 2020 election to make it more neutral per the neutral point of view rules
• After discussion with Isaidnoway, change the text of the section to:
  • On his Fox News broadcast, Hilton demanded an investigation into false claims of election fraud following the 2020 presidential election, clips of which were tweeted by Trump.

References

After further discussion, Isaidnoway said they would like additional feedback from other editors, which is why I'm making this post. I'd welcome anyone's thoughts on this proposed change. SKflo (talk) 21:48, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

 Done but since the rationale for the request was to remove the statement that Hilton was amplifying Trump's false claims, I kept the background about Biden beating Trump. In 40-50 years, people may not immediately associate the 2020 election with the two candidates who ran in it. STEMinfo (talk) 21:23, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

Citizenship request

Hi editors, I had a small request to make of the introduction. Could we change the description of Steve to "British–American"? As noted in the article he became an American citizen in May 2021. The San Francisco Chronicle recently verified his U.S. citizenship as well. Please let me know what you think! SKflo (talk) 17:00, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

Approved  Spintendo  03:42, 1 December 2023 (UTC)